help for battle for middle-eart

[thudo]

My brother (whom I'm trying to play with) does not have ADSL-2, he has ordinary ADSL with PPPoE client. (username/pass)

So I guess it would be hard to match our settings exactly... :(

I had no idea you had to be on the same type of connection to use GIT though?

You don't need to be on the same connection for it to work. You just have to ensure both sides have the latest connection software running, are all set to defaults, ensure nothing "funky" is set in your network settings (has he checked nothing odd is running on startup?), match GiT settings precisely between connectors (use something like Skype, Ventrilo, TeamSpeak, etc to chat voice-over-IP to make the changes in real-time). Ensure no Firewalls are running (ZoneAlarm, OS' firewall)..

Something is obviously not working.. have it first grab the latest PPPoE client from his ISP, uninstall it COMPLETELY, reboot, reinstall new PPPoE client, test to ensure he get on fine, check OS for anything running that shouldn't or looks "out of place".. Go to START/RUN and type: msconfig and then go to last tab.. check to see what is running on startup and disable what looks like it shouldn't be there.

We played another 3hr BfmE game last nite (just two of us) connected directly to your modems. Worked flawlessly. Now we just need to get 3+ players to see how that goes.

Merry Christmas everyone! All the best!

[Ironcraft]

Now, essentially, what you did was fool the game into using the LOWER IP address (you real WAN IP) instead of the higher one (192.168.xxx.xxx LAN IP) which is where some games screw up when NATs are involved. Stupid? Yes. Developer laziness and failure to acknowledge that most people these days WILL use NATs especially due to increased hackers on the Net? MOST DEFINITELY!

I think I can explain, why you must have a LOWER IP of the WAN then the internal IP.

If take a look at route print of a workstation:

255.255.255.255 255.255.255.255 10.0.0.3 10.0.0.3 1
255.255.255.255 255.255.255.255 213.x.x.x 213.x.x.x 1

you see, that there are two limited multicast possiblities. One over the internal 10.0.0.3 and one with the official 213.x

Now if you sniff the network traffic, while B4me is startet, you see that the origin ip adress is 10.0.0.3 and NOT the 213.x.x.x adress.

The last charater in the line above "1" is the metric, if the metric is lower, this route (and broadcast source adress) will be used. But unfortunately I didn't figure out how to change that metric, because the default "route change" command doesn't work on 255.255.255.255.

The same is also true if you use VPN behind NAT (eg. OpenVPN). So you have two private IPs. One on the LAN adapter and the other one on the virtual VPN adapter. If the ip of the LAN adapter is "smaller" than that of the VPN adapter, then the source ip of the broadcast will be ip adress of the lan adapter, very bad.

e.g
Case A
LAN-adapter 10.56.x.x
VPN-adapter 192.168..x.
--> false source broadcast-adress = 10.56.x.x

e.g
Case B
LAN-adapter 10.56.x.x
VPN-adapter 10.0..x.x
--> right source broadcast-adress = 10.0.x.x

Hope thats a small part to solve that problem, and maybe all problems are realated that limited broadcast routing, if you have two IPs/network adapters on your workstation.

I proved my theory with two computer (1 behind NAT, 1 with dial-up) over OpenVPN
In Case A, I didn't see the hosted game in the lobby.
In Case B, I could start on both computers a game and see it on the other one.

Unfortunately, the connection then timed out if we tried to start. So B4me uses another tequnice (source/destination ip adress ?) to establish the game, although by using the network sniffer, there was no big change (same udp packets) over the VPN.

But maybe it tries to make the rest of the connection not over the VPN ?

[Ironcraft]

What I forgot,

the OpenVPN configuration was bridged, that means, that any multi/broadcast is transmitted between the clients without any need of an relay-agent. Just as you would sit in the same LAN with all other VPN clients, even NetBios broadcasts work without WINS Server.

So I think, as also thudo's research may say, that everything works fine, if you don't do NAT or use private IPs on any end. If you go "straight through" with public IPs, than everything is fine.

Strange behaviour, but maybe anyone else has an idea if even bridged VPN doesn't work for entering the game and only for the lobby.

Alle the best for Christmas

[CyberTux]

well I have read this topic but I have a bad english :(
Then wich ports must I foward on my computer ?
and if I set my GIT just like the screenshot I seen before it have to work fine ???
Sorry for my bad english... And my stupid question but It's hard to understand English for me :D

[thudo]

Excellent work Ironcraft and Merry Christmas!

Just got back from mega family celebrations so all "turkied out" :lol:

Anyway, if I tried to use the two IP workaround I mentioned many many messages back (the one used so that Warhammer40K: Dawn of War would work with more than one NAT user) and used this in BfmE with GiT, behind my Router/NAT and opened all appropriate ports *CyberTux! For using BfmE open ports 6112 and 8088-28088 (TCP/UDP both used for these)* I would not be able to see anyone in the BfmE lobby. If I go with just one IP then I can get into the lobby but the game times out when about to finally load OR noone can join mine (times out).

I think we'll need the help of Ark or the Network experts in getting this to work via GiT - Guys.. we need some help in going "that final mile" as we're almost there in getting BfmE to work LAN over Internet while behind Routers/NATs. We need a solution or advice!

[Ark]

I think I can explain, why you must have a LOWER IP of the WAN then the internal IP.

If take a look at route print of a workstation:

255.255.255.255 255.255.255.255 10.0.0.3 10.0.0.3 1
255.255.255.255 255.255.255.255 213.x.x.x 213.x.x.x 1

you see, that there are two limited multicast possiblities. One over the internal 10.0.0.3 and one with the official 213.x

Now if you sniff the network traffic, while B4me is startet, you see that the origin ip adress is 10.0.0.3 and NOT the 213.x.x.x adress.

The last charater in the line above "1" is the metric, if the metric is lower, this route (and broadcast source adress) will be used. But unfortunately I didn't figure out how to change that metric, because the default "route change" command doesn't work on 255.255.255.255.

You can typically change the metric for any network connection right in the GUI network properties. You can assign metrics to the interface itself or to each gateway. Lower numbered metrics take precedence over higher numbered ones.

[Ironcraft]

You can typically change the metric for any network connection right in the GUI network properties. You can assign metrics to the interface itself or to each gateway. Lower numbered metrics take precedence over higher numbered ones.

Ark, you are right. I think you just opened my eyes.

I only changed the metric for the interface and that didn't change the metric for the broadcast route. But I didn't thought on changing the gateway metric - I shouldn't try to get games running for longer than 12 hours .-)

[CyberTux]

arg I'm french and I don't understand what you said....
Can you make tutorials in wich you said how to make work bfme with GIT...
With ports forewaring GIT setting and game setting :D
Already thanks and sorry for my bad english

[thudo]

Ark.. I can see where to edit the Interface Metric within XP's TCP/IP settings (Go to yer Incoming Connection, then properties, double-click TCP/IP, Go to Advanced and under the IP area there is a place to insert a metric). I also see in this same area you can add a Gateway + a metric as well. I take it this is the area you mean?

Now.. the question is: if I'm behind a typical Router (note mine below) what Gateway or IP metric do I use to prevent BfmE from dying (timing out) on us as the game loads just after successfully joining my colleague's game?

[Ark]

The metrics are only used to resolve ambiguity for things like the default route (where traffic goes to find the internet by default)
If you have your game server on 192.168.0.2 or something and the game knows its on that address, the only point of the metric setting is for the GIT connection on port 213 so it knows the internet is located on the real interface and not the fake interface in the case of a virtual lan adapter or two NICs. No software, including GIT or any game, actually checks the metric itself. It is built into windows TCP/IP stack and windows uses it to determine where to send packets if things match two entries in the route table or such.

[thudo]

So in other words? How does this help all of us with GiT (latest release), BfmE, and a Router/NAT? This is the undying question.. Does it?

Basically, with the assistence of your amazing software, we have been able to get two people (one direct-connect to Internet, and myself, connected behind a Router/NAT with details in my sig) to see each other in the BfmE lobby. I can join my buddy's game but he cannot join mine (which I am NATed - it just times out). If I join his, it works as per usual but as its loading the game I don't see his progress bar as the game loads (he sees mine however) but once we reach 100% it stops, it says he disconnected and then I'm in the game but my partner's side is there but does nothing. It also says he was disconnected.

I mean... ARGGHHH! We're sooo close to getting this to work. Something in the last mile is f*ing up!

Now, as mentioned, if I go Direct-Connect to the Internet (No NAT) then it works perfectly with GiT! I see his progress bar and he, as usual, sees mine. Then I know it will work.

So.. why is the Router/NAT causing such a bloody headache? Unless there is something I'm missing? Thanks a bunch for an awesome program! Makes BattleLan look like childsplay!

[thudo]

No advice/suggestions in this matter? As mentioned we're real close to solving this when behind a Router/NAT!

[LaggStorm]

After trying VPN along with GIT to no avail, we decided to scrap everything and follow the Git instructions to the letter. I changed my wan IP range to match my friends his was 192.168.15.1-10 so I changed my to 192.168.15.11-21. After all the things we had tried, this turned out to be the prime reason we could not get a game on. Funny how GIT actuallys says this when setting up a generic tcp session. ;) Without the matching lan ips, we could see each other in the lobby, see each others games and join, but would time out. With the matching LAN ips, the minute we fired up GIT, Kerio Personal Firewall warned me that his router was trying to establish a MS File and Print session. While I dont pretend to understand why, we were excited because we were finally getting a different reaction. We can both play each other now, but the big battles are so laggy, sometimes completely pausing for up to 3 minutes, I dont think all the headaches were worth it. We tried for a week straight, got it working, played two games and havent even wanted to play again. I dont think this is a problem with GIT, although Im sure I could get a better reaction if I fine tuned the settings. Reading some bfme forums, the incredible lag seems to be by design, which doesnt suprise me from previous EA experience. With this said, our connection details are below:

Previously stated LAN IP config
Both went DMZ on routers. This could probably be tuned by opening ports, but we just wanted it to work and worry about security, later.
Both used wizard for generic tcp, using our each others external IP's when prompted. When all was said and done, we both had one entry on the config, which listed the others external IP, on port 213.
Advanced config is nothing special, only checked is Forward ARP, All IPv4 protocols, Match source port,and dont send routable.

Things that are noteworthy are:
We tried the loopback thing, no go. We tried Alter Source IP (for NAT), no dice. We tried VPN and GIT together, no go.
After we matched LAN ip's we still could not get a game going until we both disabled our personal firewalls. We did not get prompted by the firewall of incoming our outgoing connections, but disabled for the hell of it and it worked. We are both using Kerio Personal Firewall. After the fact there was nothing in the firewall logs that would jump out at you, but BattleLAN also does not show up in Kerio logs, so that didnt suprise me.

Hopefully this is helpful to someone. If someone has the time to fine tune both their routers and GIT to only allow what is needed for the game, I would be very interested, as IMO, the game is barely playable single player, and it rediculously slow in multi. We decided we would wait for a patch to play again, but if someone has the time to fine tune the setup, I would much appreciate the info, to use when a patch that fixes BFME memory leak comes out. Good luck, hope you get it working.
:D

[thudo]

Okie.. wait wait.. wait a sec here..

In summation/review:

a) YOU MUST HAVE MATCHING LAN IPS (ie. 192.168.15.1-10 for one person behind Router while other will have 192.168.15.11-21 behind his Router - and so on for other Routered players).
b) In the DMZ (for people with Routers) although BfmE uses Ports 8088-28088 and GiT uses 213
c) In GiT, used Generic TCP template, using each others External IP (usual stuff) + Port 213
d) In GiT, under Advanced Config had Forward ARP, all IPv4 Protocols, Match Source Port and Don't Send Routable ALL CHECKED!
e) TURN OFF ALL SOFTWARE FIREWALLS! (surprised you didn't have this disabled in the first place. :lol: )

Now.. question is: this probably could work **BUT** what happens when one of those people connecting is NOT behind a Router/NAT? Do we all have to match the direct-connector's external IP (ie. 65.xxx.xxx.xxx)? Less than half of my colleagues are NOT behind routers.. how would they connect your way?

Btw.. thank you a bunch for that post! At least now we all may have a greater understanding how we can workaround probably the hardest netcode to get working over da net! Also, please check above to ensure I got all the steps summated! 8)

[AlienHack]

Problems with the game and GIT here too. I just wonder why EA couldnt just put a direct ip host/connect option...

Me and my friends are all connected to a Wireless MAN network. It covers the whole city, 250 users online.

We each have a static real ip (not behind nat) , for example one has 10.104.104.6 , other has 10.122.2.5 , other 10.100.76.8 etc.

the only common thing we have is our subnet address. 255.255.255.192

As you can see the problem here is that we all have diferent ip ranges so the game cant work on network mode. So we run GIT. I pinpoint the other users comp, he pinpoints in GIT mine. He can see me in the network menu, i cant see him. when i make a game and he tries to connects he gets time out.

I've read the whole thread. As far as i understand we have to be in the same ip range? thats impossible and thats the reason we cant play form the start and we have to use GIT... I just mentions that by using git and forward all ports we can play WARHAMMER 40K in network mode with no probs and no lag. But BFME refuses to work...